Does email marketing work for agencies?

Agency Leadership Podcast

In this episode, Chip and Gini discuss the importance of email marketing for agencies. They emphasize that email newsletters should be a top priority for agencies to nurture leads, share content, and maintain direct communication with clients.

The conversation highlights the risks of relying solely on social media platforms, which can change or disappear. They also advise agency owners to publish thought leadership content to differentiate themselves and align with their values, despite potential fear of alienating prospects.

Lastly, they stress the importance of owning one’s content and not just focusing on the size of the email list, but rather the quality of engagement and relevance to the audience.

Key takeaways

• Chip Griffin: “The vast majority of agencies I talk to do not regularly send an email newsletter or anything like that. And I think it is a giant mistake for an agency.”
• Gini Dietrich: “The idea that you are essentially renting out your content or selling your content for free to a social media platform that you don’t own is dangerous. The fact that you don’t have all of those followers and subscribers in an email database that you own is really scary because it could go away.”
• Chip Griffin: “The reason why clients hire you is not because you have the best team in the world. The differentiator comes in the form of your ideas and your thought on how do you approach things.”
• Gini Dietrich: “Email marketing helps you do business development in a way that doesn’t feel sleazy, that feels more comfortable for our people pleasing personalities. And it does it in a way that generates those leads for you so that they’re coming in, they’re inbound versus you having to make cold calls and do outbound.”

Related

• What kind of content should you create to market your agency?
• Eating your own dog food and marketing your agency (featuring Aaron Strout)

View Transcript

The following is a computer-generated transcript. Please listen to the audio to confirm accuracy.

Chip Griffin: Hello and welcome to another episode of the Agency Leadership Podcast. I’m Chip Griffin.

Gini Dietrich: I’m Gini Dietrich.

Chip Griffin: And Gini, I think I’m going to just start spamming the heck out of you. I’m going to email you all day, every day.

Gini Dietrich: I can’t wait. My inbox will thank you.

Chip Griffin: I already sent you a fair number of emails, mostly with, you know, humorous observations or depressing thoughts about the overall environment we live in.

Gini Dietrich: Yeah, we do have a lot of that stuff.

Chip Griffin: Indeed. But, we’re actually going to talk about email and how it relates to, How agencies can grow. How important are email lists or email newsletters for agencies? Should they care about them? Should it be a priority? Should they forget about it and just go do something else?

Outreach on LinkedIn, direct mail, direct message spamming on LinkedIn, or cold calling, or all of these other tactics. So where does, where do newsletters and email fit in?

Gini Dietrich: The answer is yes, email should be a top marketing priority. Yes, you should do it. And yes, it should be done very well. You also should learn how to do email marketing to nurture leads, to speak to clients and to share your content with a larger audience.

So there are lots of, lots of opportunities for you to use email marketing, but to ignore it. You may do so at your own peril.

Chip Griffin: Well, and I don’t know about you, but I, the vast majority of agencies I talk to do not regularly send an email newsletter or anything like that. And I think it is a giant mistake for an agency.

Not to do that. And the reason why they tend not to do that is because they don’t actually publish any kind of content of any kind. They may have a blog, but it usually is used to announce that, you know, they won some award or they hired someone new or something like that. But there is very little in the way for most agencies of true thought leadership. I know people get allergic to that term, but I think it’s, if you don’t have any thoughts, why are you doing what you’re doing?

Gini Dietrich: Right. Right. Yeah. I mean, I completely agree with you and there, there’s a couple of things happening. One, I think that social media is so much easier in our brains to handle quote unquote thought leadership there than to do it on our blog or via an email newsletter.

So we tend to just sway over there. There’s lots of really great examples on LinkedIn, especially of late, of agency owners that are handling LinkedIn thought leadership really well. And that’s fine. All of those things are fine. Like, I would rather you do that than nothing at all. But also, the idea that you are, essentially renting out your content or selling your content for free essentially to something that you don’t own is really dangerous.

So the fact that you don’t have all of those followers and subscribers in an email database that you own is really scary because it could go away. You know, we’ve had instances where the Clubhouse was a big thing for podcasting for, I think in 2020, and people put all their ducks in that, eggs in that basket and it went away and they lost all that.

There’s been, you know, Vine, Google Plus. There’s been all sorts of things that people have invested their time, their resources, their community, their engagement into those places and they’ve gone away. We’re seeing that happen with TikTok where we don’t know what’s going to happen from a a government regulatory perspective.

Is it going to go away? And all these people are like, but I’m creating all of my content on TikTok. Don’t do that. Please do something. And your email newsletter can be as simple as what you would do on LinkedIn anyway. You’re already creating that content. Do it in email instead of on LinkedIn. Or repurpose it on LinkedIn so that you can get it to a wider audience.

But your number one priority should be something that you own every single time.

Chip Griffin: Absolutely. And look, I mean, I would rather that you publish something on LinkedIn or TikTok than not at all.

Gini Dietrich: Yeah, absolutely.

Chip Griffin: Unfortunately, the vast majority of agency owners aren’t publishing anything anywhere in any form. And, and to the extent they are, they’re just, you know, it’s just casual reposting of other content or, you know, just, just really quick, you know, high level, you know, kind, soft, gentle, but nothing that really plants a stake in the ground and says, this is what I think, this is what my target audience ought to be focused on today.

And I think you’re missing a giant opportunity to separate yourself from the pack. Because the reason why clients hire you is not because you have the best team in the world. You’ll all tell me that. Every single one of you will say, my team is our great differentiator. They’re the most creative. They’re the most experienced.

I only hire the best. Rubbish. Everybody says it. It’s not a differentiator. The differentiator comes in the form of your ideas and your thought on how do you approach these things. It’s what you and I do every single week on this show. We plant a flag in the ground and we say what we think. Like what we’re doing today.

You may like it. You may not. If you like it, you’re more likely to work with us. That’s great. If not, so what? You can’t be afraid to offend people. It doesn’t mean you need to go out and be offensive. Right. But I think one of the problems is that agency owners are reluctant to plant that flag because they’re afraid they’re going to turn off potential clients by being forceful in their views.

Gini Dietrich: Well, yes, and one of the things that I would say to that is what are you telling clients? So you’re what we’re seeing this big shift toward organizations need to stand up for their values. We need to stand up for our morals. We need to communicate what our values are and what’s important to us because Gen Z and the younger millennials, that’s what they buy.

They buy from companies where their values are aligned. So, when you’re talking to clients and they’re saying, Well, I don’t want to talk about my values because I might alienate half of my customer base. We have to get them to the point of being okay with that. And the same thing with you. You have to be okay with attracting the types of people that you want to work with because your values align.

I don’t want to attract the people that, like our values don’t align because we’re not gonna enjoy that working relationship. So I’m going to alienate half of them. Okay, great That means they’re not gonna call. They’re not gonna waste my time. They’re not gonna kick the tires. They’re not gonna try to nickel and dime me none of that stuff because our values don’t align Fantastic.

They self select out. So that’s what you should be focused on Is how do we attract the right types of clients, the people that we want to work with? And the values, we have the values that are aligned, so that we all have a great working relationship and we can do our best.

Chip Griffin: Yeah, and to be clear, you know, from my perspective, I think you should be focused on your business values and, and your strategies and viewpoints.

You know, there’s a lot of discussion around should agencies, should businesses talk about politics and those kinds of things. My view on that is if you feel strongly about it and it, and it’s something that, that truly energizes you, fine. Go ahead and talk about it. Don’t be afraid to alienate people on the basis of that. But at the same time, I don’t think you should be feel obligated to do that.

And I think all these brands that feel like, well, we need to go out and talk about how we feel politically, because, you know, Gen Z says they care about that. First of all, I think that’s a bit of rubbish because Gen Z doesn’t really, they don’t buy from you if you agree with them, they just won’t buy from you if you disagree with them.

So all you’re really doing is, is turning off some group by getting involved in those conversations. So if you feel strongly about it, great, but don’t do it out of obligation. But you have an obligation to be thoughtful about the advice that you’re providing clients. Why don’t you share that in an email newsletter?

That’s a great place to say that you, you know, how you feel about paid advertising today, paid search, Tik Tok, video, podcasts, all these different things. Talk about how you see them. What is your worldview? What are your recommendations to clients? Don’t be afraid to say, if you think that video is the thing that they should be focused on, say that.

I don’t care if the clients are not interested in video. If they’re not, they’re not the right fit for you anyway. Find the clients who are the right fit with the strategies and tactics that you believe will actually produce results.

Gini Dietrich: Yeah. And I mean, the, the world of earned media has changed significantly, especially this year because of all the layoffs that we’ve seen in the newsrooms.

And so earned media is shifting toward more like social media news, news anchors and influencers and review sites and places like that, where we have to focus. So talk about that. You know, talk about the fact that if you’re a PR firm owner, that there was just a conversation the other day in a, in a Facebook group about how a client had said, how do we… This feature on us is great. Thank you. But how do we make sure that we get to review it the next one ahead of time so that it’s more about us and our process and what we’re doing versus about the industry as a whole that we’re included in? And the PR agency owner was like, by advertising? Like you, you can’t. But so have those kinds of conversations. Have the kinds of conversations that just because you’re hiring a PR firm, doesn’t mean you’re going to be on the front page of the New York Times.

And even if you are, what does that do for your business? So there are lots of things that you can talk about that, yeah, you might piss off some people, but you’re also going to attract people who are like, you know what? I like the way that they think. I like the way that they approach things. And I want my

agency to be focused on those kinds of things.

Chip Griffin: Yeah, and by having an email newsletter or blog – owned properties that you’re able to use to communicate your thoughts, it also forces you to think some things through. So, if you’re trying to figure out where does AI fit in for your agency today, that’s a great thing to take as a topic to start to write about or to talk about in a video or a podcast that you then promote on email.

Whatever, I mean, if you’re comfortable talking to a camera, but you can’t stand writing, fine. Do that.

Gini Dietrich: Great. Yes, absolutely.

Chip Griffin: I’m not telling you there’s one particular way you need to do it, but you need to find some way to get your thoughts out there and you need to have it be via some property that you own and control so that nobody can take it away from you.

Nobody can change the rules in the middle of the game and say, Nope, you can no longer do this kind of thing. You can’t reach these kinds of people. You can’t download your content. All these different things that frankly, all of these platforms have done or will do at one point or another.

Gini Dietrich: You know, one of the things that the PESO model certification teaches is how to kind of figure this out for yourself.

And it’s, it’s how to create content that will attract your ideal prospect. And so we, the, the first two modules really work through this. It teaches you how to look to see what people are Googling. It looks, it makes, it forces you to sit down and say, okay, when I’m in a new business meeting, what questions do I get?

And sometimes it’s things like. You know, how much does it cost and things like that, which aren’t great newsletter topics, but you also get things like, what’s your process? And how do you think? And, you know, if PR firm agency owners get this one too, what, who are your contacts or your meeting contacts? So, so focused on the kinds of things, the kinds of questions that you get anyway, and the things people are searching for online are the things that you should create content on. And your example of AI and using it, using your content to kind of think through is such a good one because that’s what I do. Like, I’ve looked at our AI content for the last, probably 19, 20 months, when Chat GPT started, became available to all of us. I started writing content, creating content around AI.

And I’ve watched that. I’ve looked at the sort of process that I’ve gone through and how much more sophisticated and in depth my thinking has become around it. Where in the beginning, it was like, this is a cool tool, check it out. And now it’s more like, this is where things are going and, you know, it’s really more in depth.

So it helps you to your point think through things and start to solidify things and say, okay, that didn’t quite work or resonate, let’s switch it to this. And it helps you do those things. And people are really forgiving if you say 18 months ago this is a really cool tool. You should use it, to This is actually something that you should be implementing into your day to day lives, and this is why.

Chip Griffin: Absolutely and you know, I often get told by clients.

Well, you know, we don’t really have time for this You know, it’s you know, we don’t really we don’t have the time for business development. First of all You got to make the time because these are all things that you should be doing. You should be thinking about these things anyway. But the other thing I would say to you is this is not a business development only thing.

This helps you with your existing clients as well. I can tell you that most of my clients are avid listeners to this podcast. So hello, clients. It’s a great way to extend your communication with your clients because if you’re emailing them content, if you’re sharing them, sharing with them your ideas, they will consume that.

You can use it as a way also if you’re an agency to help convince people of your overall strategies because now you’re not just meeting with them one on one saying, you should do this. You’ve now shared broadly with the world, your view on how things can be done most effectively in 2024, or whenever you’re putting the content out.

And so that is a compelling argument and something that you and your team can use to advance the tactics and strategies with your clients in those meetings. And it shows that you’re out there and thinking about things and that you’re not just reacting to their requests for things, which means you’ll improve your retention.

So there are so many reasons to do this far beyond just, you know, we need to, we don’t have enough time to spend on business development because we’re so busy with our client work. This is client work also.

Gini Dietrich: This is client work. And I don’t know how many of you have had this happen. I’ve had it happen where a client has said, Hey, we’re thinking we’re, we’re going to hire an agency to do X, Y, Z.

Can you work with us to hire them? And you’re like, we do that work. What do you mean? Because it’s not something that they’ve hired you for and you’re not communicating the other types of services that you have. And so they don’t know. They don’t know, like they don’t come to your website every day. They don’t read your blog every day.

You have to actually send it to them and be proactive about it. because otherwise they don’t even. They don’t even think, they’re just like, oh, we hired them to do digital marketing, or we hired them to do content, or we hired them to do media relations, whatever happens to be, and we didn’t know they also did this, this, and this.

So you have to be really proactive about that kind of stuff, because it’s just not top of mind for them. You know, I, I always say it’s incredibly frustrating that clients and employees don’t read our content. So I’m always shoving it in front of their faces. Hey, read this. I think you’ll find it interesting because of this, this, and this.

So you, you have to do those things because otherwise, they don’t know. They just don’t. And that’s your fault, not theirs.

Chip Griffin: Absolutely. And by, by getting this content out there and, and making people think about it, it’s an opportunity for you to really develop your approach to things.

Gini Dietrich: Yeah,

Chip Griffin: right. So if you start to have, and part of the problem is that a lot of agency owners are so reactive because they feel like they’re busy.

So all they’re doing is implementing the ideas that their clients have, and they’re not taking a look around the corner, as it were, and saying, okay, what’s coming next? How can, how can I move my agency in the right direction? And by creating this content, it gives you that opportunity to be more forward looking and to make sure that you’re not playing catch up.

It doesn’t mean you have to live way out, you know, at the, at the rubber band end of things, right? You know, you need to be realistic and focus on what clients need today. But, creating content allows you to start thinking about, you know, where is this road headed? And how can we position ourselves for success with our clients?

And by the way, those clients need to be your target, your prospect, that’s who you need to be speaking to. I see a lot of content put out by agencies that’s, and I’ve been guilty of this a lot over the years,

Gini Dietrich: talking to my peers.

Chip Griffin: That’s not what you need to do.

Gini Dietrich: Nope. Nope.

Chip Griffin: You need to be, you need to be thinking about the topics that are on the minds of your clients and prospects and you need to speak in their language. So you can’t, if you are a web dev firm, you can’t talk about really complicated in depth technical issues.

You need to put it in terms that matter to your prospect or client, so that they understand the big picture and how you’re fitting into it, not, you know, what you’re actually doing from a coding perspective to actually get things done.

Gini Dietrich: Absolutely. And the other thing I would say about, email marketing specifically and you know having a list and sending to your list pretty consistently is that many of us and you alluded to this earlier don’t like quote unquote business development because we see it as cold calling, we see it as you know approaching somebody who may not be ready.

We see it as sleazy. We see it as sort of used car salesman kind of thing and it’s not that at all. What email marketing and being consistent about content development does is it opens those doors for you. So it helps you generate leads, It helps you generate qualified leads so that by the time you have a conversation with somebody they’re already halfway or three fourths of the way down the purchase funnel and they’re ready to talk to you about I really like the way that you think.

I really like the way that you run your agency, and I’d like to talk to you about helping us do this work for my organization. So it’s helping you do business development in a way that doesn’t feel sleazy, that feels more comfortable for our people pleasing personalities. And it does it in a way that generates those leads for you so that they’re coming in, they’re inbound versus you having to make cold calls and do outbound

Chip Griffin: Absolutely.

The final thing I would say about email is don’t focus on the size of the list. This is, this is another thing I hear from a lot of agency owners. Well, you know, I, I started doing email, but you know, then we, we, we didn’t really have thousands of names. So I, you know, , I didn’t think it was worthwhile to spend time on it. Or, you know, geez, you know, I’ve got a list, but I’ve only got a few hundred names.

I really need to get to 10, 000. No, no, it’s not about quantity. It’s about the quality of your list. So these should be people who are interested in hearing from you. So this is not just go randomly harvest names and throw them on the list or buy some list from somewhere else or any of these kinds of things.

This is building relationships with people. And if you’ve got a list of 50 or 100 people, but there are people who are potentially interested in what you do or can refer you to other folks, and they’re receptive to the content that you’re sharing, that’s all you need.

Gini Dietrich: That’s all you need.

Chip Griffin: I mean, you should keep growing it.

I’m not telling you stop once you get to 50 or 100 names, but you don’t need to have. Thousands, tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands of names. In fact, there are plenty of examples of folks out there who have massive email lists who don’t really get a return on that investment. So focus on the quality, not the quantity.

Gini Dietrich: Yeah, and you’re right. Fifty names, a hundred names, a hundred and fifty names. It doesn’t matter. As long as they are engaged and there are people who want to hear from you and they will buy from you, that’s what you should focus on.

Chip Griffin: And you should be getting value out of creating the content anyway, right?

And if you’re, if you’re getting value out of creating it and you’re getting it out to those people, and you’re also publishing it to your website so that it has long term search legs, right? You now are getting a lot of value out of these individual pieces of content. And a lot of this doesn’t have to be stuff that you’re creating even initially for the email newsletter. You are probably putting together things for clients.

Clients are going to ask you, what are your thoughts on AI? So you write a memo and you share it with them. Guess what? You can take that as the basis for a blog post, which becomes part of your email content, which you can then turn into a video or a podcast episode. You don’t need to keep reinventing the wheel every time.

You’re already creating a lot of things in all likelihood that can be the basis, not exactly word for word, right? You can’t use the specific examples maybe that you’re using with the individual client, but the general principles of it and the research that you’ve done can be reapplied with relatively little effort.

So do it.

Gini Dietrich: Yep. Yep. Yep. And the last thing I will leave you with is, especially if you’re doing any content marketing or subject matter experts for your clients, Think about the way that you get their thinking and their subject matter expertise out of their brains to create the content. That’s the same process that you’ll use for your own kind of stuff.

Chip Griffin: And look, if you need to have someone on your team interview you, transcribe it, and take a first cut at it, great, right? If you hate writing, I’m not telling you to do it. You can talk to them, have it transcribed, and go from there. You can hire someone on the outside to help you with it. There’s a lot of different ways that you can get there without a whole lot of time on your part, without a whole lot of expense, but you’re putting out quality content that will pay huge dividends to you over time.

Gini Dietrich: Or go through the PESO model certification. Cause we subject you to it.

Chip Griffin: Absolutely. So with that, we will draw this episode of the Agency Leadership Podcast to a close. I’m Chip Griffin.

Gini Dietrich: I’m Gini Dietrich.

Chip Griffin: And it depends.